E-Mail and Xfinity Connect Help

[johnfhess]

I am subscribed to an email list that is being rejected by Comcast. I am allowed to send email to the list, but do not receive copies or replies.   I attempted to resolve the problem using the online chat and was told to fill out a "blocked" email form.  I did and was told that the IP address I supplied was not blocked. My intepretation is that BLOCKED means I can't send email to that address.  That is not the case, Comcast is NOT ALLOWING the email to get to me.  Comcast is rejecting email from the list serve. 

Here are snippets of logs from the listserve owner with email addressess xxed out:

May 17 07:20:24 linux postfix/nqmgr[1830]: 49FC298935:
to=<xxxxxxx@comcast.net>, relay=none, delay=298501, status=deferred (connect
to mx1a.comcast.net[76.96.62.116]: server refused mail service)
May 17 07:20:24 linux postfix/nqmgr[1830]: 49FC298935:
to=<xxxxxxx@comcast.net>, relay=none, delay=298501, status=deferred (connect
to mx1a.comcast.net[76.96.62.116]: server refused mail service)
May 17 07:20:24 linux postfix/nqmgr[1830]: 49FC298935:
to=<xxxxxxx@comcast.net>, relay=none, delay=298501, status=deferred
(connect to mx1a.comcast.net[76.96.62.116]: server refused mail service)
 

I phoned comcast and was told that the list serve owner had to fill out this page:

http://www.comcastsupport.com/forms/net/blockedprovider.asp

The list serve owner filled out and submitted the form and received this form letter reply:

"We have received your request for removal from our inbound blocklist. After investigating the issue, we have found that the IP you provided for removal is currently not on our blocklist.

We need the IP address currently blocked to further investigate this issue. The IP address is a number separated by decimals and is located in an error code starting with "550" in the returned email from Comcast. You can learn more about how to identify a blocked IP by visiting our Frequently Asked Question page at :
http://www.comcast.net/help/faq/index.jsp?faq=SecurityMail_Policy18667"

This web page address is incorrect, I am not shown policy 18667, but am dumped at the help page start.

I believe I have been very understanding and the list serve owner has been helpful, but Comcast is still not allowing Comcast subscribers to receive the email list.

Who can I contact about this?  I have spoken with high speed internet help and they referred me to the same form as has been filled out.

[CCCarole]

I have asked a Moderator to review your post.

[ComcastHeather]

What is the ip of the server sending the mail?  

[johnfhess]

The list is question is the Davis Bike Club email list, dbclist.org

here is the relevant part of the Comcast reply indicating that the source of the email list is not BLOCKED.

Below each IP address you submitted in your request, we have included the result of our research. Please do not reply to this message.

168.150.240.230

We have received your request for removal from our inbound blocklist. After investigating the issue, we have found that the IP you provided for removal is currently not on our blocklist.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

here is a snippet of a past, successful email:

received: from linux.dbclist.org ([168.150.240.230]) by IMTA21.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Message Edited by johnfhess on 05-23-2009 08:53 AM

[ComcastHeather]

It is not on the block list you are trying to remove it from.  The sender should be receiving an error message containing the following url http://help.comcast.net/content/faq/BL001000.  This will provide information on the block and information on how to remediate.

[johnfhess]

Thank you for the help. we are working on the web page lead you have provided.  The fact that the error message is supposed to include this text doesn't sound like what is actually occuring, I have provided lines of text from teh list serves logs all they do not include ref to the BL001 page, they simply say server refused mail service.

We have known all along that it's not on the so called blocked list, but no one would listen.  Every time we called Comcast, the person on the phone said you have to go here to remove the block.

[steve-baker]

---

johnfhess wrote:

Thank you for the help. we are working on the web page lead you have provided.  The fact that the error message is supposed to include this text doesn't sound like what is actually occuring, I have provided lines of text from teh list serves logs all they do not include ref to the BL001 page, they simply say server refused mail service.

---

When an IP address is blocked, Comcast sends the error message with the relevant text in the SMTP greeting. Lots of mailservers don't quite grok that, and so don't include that error message from Comcast in the bounce message that gets sent back to the sender. Ironically, last I knew, Comcast doesn't quite grok such error messages when they're similarly blocked.

[johnfhess]

Well this just continues.  Comcast filters out, ie doesn't accept email from a bicycle email list I'm on based on the existence of an IP address on a list at some other company.  And I'm left to deal with it.  <sarcasm>GREAT </sarcasm>.  Going to the site listed above, I (that is capital I, me, not comcast) have to fill out a form to submit to Trend Micro to get the server de-listed.  here's only a small part of the reply I got:

168.150.240.230 is listed on the Trend Micro Dynamic User
List (DUL) because it appears to be an IP address that is
dynamically assigned. This does not imply that you are a
spammer, though a great deal of spam comes from computers
using dynamic addresses.

Is that great or what?  I'm **bleep** as are other Comcast folks subscribing to the  same email list because the server IP is DYNAMICALLY ASSIGNED>  My IP address through Comcast is dynmically assigned, the charge more for a static IP.

Meanwhile, I'm left doing this **bleep** because my friend who runs the list actually has a job and runs the list as a favor to the Bike Club and most folks arent effected, just us poor Comcast subscribers.

It's comcastic! 

[FishMan]

---

johnfhess wrote:

Well this just continues.  Comcast filters out, ie doesn't accept email from a bicycle email list I'm on based on the existence of an IP address on a list at some other company.  And I'm left to deal with it.  <sarcasm>GREAT </sarcasm>.  Going to the site listed above, I (that is capital I, me, not comcast) have to fill out a form to submit to Trend Micro to get the server de-listed.  here's only a small part of the reply I got:

168.150.240.230 is listed on the Trend Micro Dynamic User
List (DUL) because it appears to be an IP address that is
dynamically assigned. This does not imply that you are a
spammer, though a great deal of spam comes from computers
using dynamic addresses.

Is that great or what?  I'm **bleep** as are other Comcast folks subscribing to the  same email list because the server IP is DYNAMICALLY ASSIGNED>  My IP address through Comcast is dynmically assigned, the charge more for a static IP.

Meanwhile, I'm left doing this **bleep** because my friend who runs the list actually has a job and runs the list as a favor to the Bike Club and most folks arent effected, just us poor Comcast subscribers.

It's comcastic! 

---

It is normal and reasonalble that ISPs block email originating from a server in a dynamically assigned ip address range. Search Google and you'll see how common this is. It is likely that many of his intended recipients on other ISPs are not receiving his emails for the reason they are originating from the dynamic ip address range.

There is a simple solution for your friend. All he has to do is correctly configure his email server to use a smart host, I.E. his ISPs smtp address.

This is not a Comcast issue to fix, it is your friend's issue to correctly configure his email server or find a host on which to run his email server.

Another, and maybe a better solution for him would be to set up a bike group using Google Groups or other service.

Message Edited by FishMan on 05-23-2009 07:28 AM

Message Edited by FishMan on 05-23-2009 07:45 AM

[johnfhess]

actually, as I said, it's just the Comcast subscribers who have been effected.  I know, Ive seen the logs.  I have worked around Comcast's blockade by subscribing through my gmail account; Google lets this email traffic through just fine while comcast filters it.  Through my comcast account, I get one or 2 spam messages "I've won this or that lottery" but I hardly ever see spam in my Google account.

here's one this AM

From:     edited@msn.com
    Subject:     Can I give you this trust?
    Date:     May 23, 2009 4:54:36 AM PDT
    Reply-To:     edited@gmail.com

Can't get the bike club email, but edited gets through.   I guess he doesn't use a dynamically assigned ISP and therefore can't possibly be spam?

I feel sorry for everyone else who might not know anything about computers and don't know the list serve owner who I think has been quite helpful and tolerant.

The funny thing is that I wouldn't have thought that an EMAIL problem would lead me to ditch Comcast TV for Direct TV, but I'm paying so much to Comcast every month that this is really not acceptable.

Message Edited by johnfhess on 05-23-2009 08:52 AM

[FishMan]

---

johnfhess wrote:

actually, as I said, it's just the Comcast subscribers who have been effected.  I know, Ive seen the logs.  I have worked around Comcast's blockade by subscribing through my gmail account; Google lets this email traffic through just fine while comcast filters it.  Through my comcast account, I get one or 2 spam messages "I've won this or that lottery" but I hardly ever see spam in my Google account.

here's one this AM

From:     <removed for privacy>@msn.com
    Subject:     Can I give you this trust?
    Date:     May 23, 2009 4:54:36 AM PDT
    Reply-To:     <removed for privacy>@gmail.com

Can't get the bike club email, but abuhammed gets through.   I guess he doesn't use a dynamically assigned ISP and therefore can't possibly be spam?

I feel sorry for everyone else who might not know anything about computers and don't know the list serve owner who I think has been quite helpful and tolerant.

The funny thing is that I wouldn't have thought that an EMAIL problem would lead me to ditch Comcast TV for Direct TV, but I'm paying so much to Comcast every month that this is really not acceptable.

---

I would think if someone is running an email server they would, or should, know how to configure it. As I said, the solution is simple. Changing ISPs is much more difficult than changing one email server setting.

So good luck with your new ISP. What are you going to do when you find that your new ISP does not accept email from servers in dynamic ip address ranges?

Message Edited by FishMan on 05-23-2009 08:43 AM

[FishMan]

---

johnfhess wrote:

Well this just continues.  Comcast filters out, ie doesn't accept email from a bicycle email list I'm on based on the existence of an IP address on a list at some other company.  And I'm left to deal with it.  <sarcasm>GREAT </sarcasm>.  Going to the site listed above, I (that is capital I, me, not comcast) have to fill out a form to submit to Trend Micro to get the server de-listed.  here's only a small part of the reply I got:

168.150.240.230 is listed on the Trend Micro Dynamic User
List (DUL) because it appears to be an IP address that is
dynamically assigned. This does not imply that you are a
spammer, though a great deal of spam comes from computers
using dynamic addresses.

Is that great or what?  I'm **bleep** as are other Comcast folks subscribing to the  same email list because the server IP is DYNAMICALLY ASSIGNED>  My IP address through Comcast is dynmically assigned, the charge more for a static IP.

Meanwhile, I'm left doing this **bleep** because my friend who runs the list actually has a job and runs the list as a favor to the Bike Club and most folks arent effected, just us poor Comcast subscribers.

It's comcastic! 

---

And like your friend if you run an email server from your Comcast dynamically assigned email address your server's outgoing emails will be blocked either by Comcast or by the recipient's ISP since the emails originated from a dynamically assigned email address. Properly configured email servers in dynamic address ranges use the smart host configuration. Email server developers understand this hence the reason they include the smart host setting in their email server software.

[FishMan]

You should remove the email addresses you included in your post. Spamming is a different issue than what is being discussed. The spammers have likely hijacked an innocent user's email account and are using that to send their spam email.

They spoof some innocent user's email address so the addresses you included probably belong to some innocent users who don't even know they are being spoofed. I think they may not appreciate their email addresses being published in this forum.

[Barmar]

---

johnfhess wrote:

actually, as I said, it's just the Comcast subscribers who have been effected.  I know, Ive seen the logs.

---

You said the address is on a Trend Micro list, not a Comcast list. Do you really think Comcast is the only customer of this Trend Micro service?

[steve-baker]

---

FishMan wrote:

It is normal and reasonalble that ISPs block email originating from a server in a dynamically assigned ip address range.

---

Absolutely! But I think Trend Micro have a mistaken listing in this case. Although most of that /24 have "generic" PTR records, there are PTR records that indicate that that address block isn't dynamically assigned. And, nobody else has that block listed as dynamic. Maybe Comcast should rethink their policy of using that list.

[Barmar]

Their IP resolves to dcn240-230.dcn.davis.ca.us, which looks like a generic, dynamically-assigned IP. Davis Community Network should be able to provide a better PTR record for their mail server.

[johnfhess]

The last word?  The block by Trend Micro was lifted from the DUL on Sunday night.  Absolutely amazing to me that a real person was either working on this as a result of my second request for block removal or as a result of their ongoing efforts.  Either way, it was the middle of the Memorial Day weekend. 

I am not sure if my requests had any bearing on the resolution as I received this as part of one reply on Sunday (from Spam Investiagtions, Trend Micro): 

Thank you for contacting us about this IP. It is part of a group of IPs owned by a small ISP in Davis, CA. I am working with them to define their rDNS to static.

Meanwhile, I have removed this IP from the DUL so that you can receive emails from the IP. 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

As I said, I asked twice for the IP address to be removed, the first time all I got was an automated reply.  I don't know if the list owner carried on with the requests for unblocking or if the folks at DCN were quietly behind the scenes. I do plan to do some checking, just for my own information.

[steve-baker]

---

Barmar wrote:
Their IP resolves to dcn240-230.dcn.davis.ca.us, which looks like a generic, dynamically-assigned IP.

True. But if Comcast only cared about patterns in PTR records they could check it themselves rather than pay for a service.
 

Davis Community Network should be able to provide a better PTR record for their mail server.

I totally agree with that.

----

johnfhess quoted a response from Trend Micro:

"Thank you for contacting us about this IP. It is part of a group of IPs owned by a small ISP in Davis, CA. I am working with them to define their rDNS to static."

Blocklists shouldn't be trying to enforce naming conventions, they should be trying to have accurate records.

[Barmar]

Steve, the people who compile lists like these have to deal with millions of addresses. It's simply not feasible for them to perform extensive investigation of each one. So they take shortcuts, depending on providers to follow naming conventions, so that people can make reasonable guesses. Some providers forward their lists of dynamic blocks to list maintainers, but the lists can't depend on this. They have to figure this stuff out on their own, and heuristics like this are part of the process. They're not enforcing naming conventions just to be arbitrary; following conventions is a way that providers communicate their intentions to the rest of the Internet.

And if there's already a company doing the work of scanning addresses and compiling lists like this, why should Comcast do it themselves? Do you think Comcast would have come to a different conclusion about these IPs if they were doing it themselves? If it quacks like a duck, everyone will think it's a duck.

Comcast doesn't only care about patterns in PTR records, they're just one of the ways that dynamic address blocks are recognized.

Message Edited by Barmar on 05-30-2009 01:13 AM